Is It Flirting ?

[sexykitty]

ok here is my problem....my man is being so insecure it is driving me crazy. I tell him all i can to reassure him that im with him and not looking for anyone else but he still just doesnt get it.

It all started about a month or two ago. My man bowls and i went to watch him. I walked into the lanes and this group of four guys bowling there all turned and looked at me. I know something was said but i cant say if the comment was good or bad. One guy told something to the rest and they all turned and looked at me. My man seen this and although he knows these guys he still says they want me. Like i said for all we know it could have been something bad being said a rude comment.

He says they are flirting with me. I disagree i dont talk to them at all. Oh yes one did ask him were i was and if i go out and where i go. Now mind you i didnt hear this first hand he said it so it may just be him trying to get a reaction out of me, Give me some advice on how to set him straight. Its not like every where i go i get all this attention but he acts like i do. He is to the point where he askes and complains why it takes me so long to get ready if i am going someplace or if we are he says who are you trying to impress. I tell him it makes me feel good so i do it for me and for him. I think he wants me to be a slob and unkept but what good would that do then he would complain and check out better looking girls im sure

pleae help me make him understand its not flirting and if it was so what.....he flirts but ofcourse says he doent....Men ugggggghhhhhhhhhhh

[Trooper]

I have always understood that flirting is when someone goes that little bit extra to impress or edge the other person on. If you have not had a conversation with them that was a little daring or done something flirty like shown a bit of leg and fluttered them eye lashes then No its not Flirting. I Don't know anything about the relationship your in so sorry if Im getting this really wrong, But when I read your post Alarm bells started to ring. I Really think you should be a lot more worried about your Man's behaviour then trying to work out if you were Flirting or not. It sounds to me as if he is starting to gain a problem? Can I ask is this new or have things been slowly building up to it? Has he shown any signs of Jealousy in the past or does he have a controlling personality? One more Question if you told him you had been invited to a hen night what would his reaction be?

Sorry to answer your Question with Questions but I feel this problem is maybe deeper or bigger then you might realise

[curvacious_lust]

My turn!!

Men do have insecurities. Your SO says the same thing mine does: Why am I dressed up and who am I trying to impress? I tell him over and over again: I dress up to look hot FOR YOU and if the other men see it, then great... they'll see I'm with YOU and they'll think what a lucky SOB you are to have this woman on your arm cause I"m not going anywhere!!

(men always complain when we're not ready on time...I think it says in the Male Handbook they have to whine even if we're just 1 minute late...LOL)

[Mikayla1]

Ok, to answer your question, NO, it is not flirting. To "flirt" you have to be a willing participant, engaging the other guys by doing something to at least call attention to yourself besides "being you." Like, talking suggestively, sucking on your straw seductively, batting your eyelashes at all of them and licking your lips - that is flirting - and probably sexual advancing. What you did, coming into the bowling alley, is NOT.

Second, Howard is a bit of an extremist. I think you should be concerned about your guy's insecurities and set him straight a bit. Hey, if he wants you to look like a slob when you leave the house, see how he likes that! I had a guy who always said I looked "too good" when I went out, so the next time he came to pick me up I had no make-up, my hair was in a ponytail (and not a cutsie one) I had on sweats and a stained t-shirt. He was like WTF???? I said, hey, you said I looked too good. I made him take me to the party and his friends all pointed and stared, but the women - they knew what I was doing! He never, ever did that to me again. I wore what I wore when I wanted to wear it - and he never said a WORD AGAIN!

Back to Howard, I am not sure if he is "sick" as much as terribly insecure! He might have had a girl cheat on him in the past, perhaps with a friend, that might be the deal. Unfortunately, if you tell him you are with him and he doesn't believe it, there is nothing else you can do.

So, before you start running for the hills, try talking to him - or, taking a less sever tactic!

Mikayla

[Mikayla1]

No Howard, I am not calling YOU sick. I just think that his actions are not to that level of "sickness" yet! I completely understand how bad things happen - I understand how obsession happens - I have been on the other side of the obsession. However, I do not think that him thinking she is flirting it cause for her to run for the hills!

How did you get ALL that information about her guy from that little post she tendered! I saw someone who is a bit jealous of her woman's attention (that she gets from guys) not a control freak - don't you think you are being a bit rash - just a bit???

I think she should watch it, and if he continues to exhibit this type of behavior, then consider leaving. It is true that men who continually doubt their women do end up doing rash things like killing them - however, I do not think we need to be alarmists every time a woman has a jealous boyfriend - do you??

Mikayla

[Mikayla1]

Howard, I think the problem with giving this type of advice is that every guy who is a little jealous will not become a murderer! I think that you will end up causing an unnecessary panic if you start making women believe that their men are going to kill them if they make a comment about them flirting with another guy!

I know that these things happen, as I said, I was on the other end of an obsessive relationship. I know there are many sickos in the world. However, this poster did not say that he was threatening her, or making her uncomfortable, or that this happens every time they go somewhere like it is an obession. I would caution her to be careful - that much I would do - other than that, I would be wary not to cause a rage of panic in her or other people who read this site.

I think that your experience in the legal field is an invaluable tool - I think that you have a lot of good advice to offer. I jsut think by saying that jealousy lead to murder...period...is kind of drastic. There are some guys who just get a littel jealous and don't have an intent to harm. There are others who would. I don't know what kind of guy he is. If this poster is nervous about him - then by all means GET OUT - if not, then just be careful.

Some women are capable of taking care of themselves. Also, to suggest that if something happens to this girl it would be MY fault is just unfair. This is a public forum where we all give advice. She is not paying me for my professional opinion any more than you. I think that was wrong and unfair of you to say that you hope "I won't have cause to regret my advice." I hope that nothing bad happens to her or anyone else on this forum - but if it does the responsibility ultimately rests with her and him - not with us! Just as if someone were to get pregnant or get an STD - it is not our fault if they do or do not follow our advice!

We do the best we can here with what we are given - that is the best we can offer. If you think you can do better than that, then I beg of you to open up a "TooTImid Professiona Advice Forum" and the members here can come to the professional guru of all things. I for one, am not about to do that.

Mikayla

[telecom69]

Howard, I think the problem with giving this type of advice is that every guy who is a little jealous will not become a murderer! I think that you will end up causing an unnecessary panic if you start making women believe that their men are going to kill them if they make a comment about them flirting with another guy!

I know that these things happen, as I said, I was on the other end of an obsessive relationship. I know there are many sickos in the world. However, this poster did not say that he was threatening her, or making her uncomfortable, or that this happens every time they go somewhere like it is an obession. I would caution her to be careful - that much I would do - other than that, I would be wary not to cause a rage of panic in her or other people who read this site.

I think that your experience in the legal field is an invaluable tool - I think that you have a lot of good advice to offer. I jsut think by saying that jealousy lead to murder...period...is kind of drastic. There are some guys who just get a littel jealous and don't have an intent to harm. There are others who would. I don't know what kind of guy he is. If this poster is nervous about him - then by all means GET OUT - if not, then just be careful.

Some women are capable of taking care of themselves. Also, to suggest that if something happens to this girl it would be MY fault is just unfair. This is a public forum where we all give advice. She is not paying me for my professional opinion any more than you. I think that was wrong and unfair of you to say that you hope "I won't have cause to regret my advice." I hope that nothing bad happens to her or anyone else on this forum - but if it does the responsibility ultimately rests with her and him - not with us! Just as if someone were to get pregnant or get an STD - it is not our fault if they do or do not follow our advice!

We do the best we can here with what we are given - that is the best we can offer. If you think you can do better than that, then I beg of you to open up a "TooTImid Professiona Advice Forum" and the members here can come to the professional guru of all things. I for one, am not about to do that.

Mikayla

I LOVE it when my gf dresses up and looks sexy or nice. I know she is dressing to look good for me. I tell her how hot or beautiful she looks while kissing her and grabbing her butt a little. At least to me, this reinforces my compliments to her and makes her want to be with me. I hope that theory works.

Sure, other guys are going to look at her sometimes. Nothing the matter with that.

Telecom

[Mikayla1]

QUOTE:

"I also used to think that women, and some men in similar situations had time to try to talk to their SOs about their jealously, because I first thought there was this natural progression from jealousy through all the stages I have described above, until I had a client who was killed by her SO when he skipped all those other stages."

Howard, does this here not say - jealousy leads to murder? It says there is a natural progressin from jealous through stages YOU describe to murder! You have to pay close attention to how you are writing things - WE ALL DO - because if I read it that way - and you DID write it that way - then others would read it that way too!

I can defer to your "expertise" in this area - I have not had the many years of experience yet in the legal field to be face to face with these people. WHat I have been privy to is a bunch of jealous boyfriends and lovers - and bf and lovers of my friends who were jealous. I have seen how things get out of hand, but I know that the woman has to pay attention and be in control. No one is saying she shouldn't be concerned - just to suggest she should leave him right now - well, that is a little over the top in my opinion. THat is all it is, really, opinions. RIght now, mine versus yours. There is no right or wrong here - just opinions. I think we have said what we are going to say and leave it to the poster to choose which OPINION she is is going to follow - or perhaps, neither!

Mikayla

[sexykitty]

I have always understood that flirting is when someone goes that little bit extra to impress or edge the other person on. If you have not had a conversation with them that was a little daring or done something flirty like shown a bit of leg and fluttered them eye lashes then No its not Flirting. I Don't know anything about the relationship your in so sorry if Im getting this really wrong, But when I read your post Alarm bells started to ring. I Really think you should be a lot more worried about your Man's behaviour then trying to work out if you were Flirting or not. It sounds to me as if he is starting to gain a problem? Can I ask is this new or have things been slowly building up to it? Has he shown any signs of Jealousy in the past or does he have a controlling personality? One more Question if you told him you had been invited to a hen night what would his reaction be?

Sorry to answer your Question with Questions but I feel this problem is maybe deeper or bigger then you might realise

well first off yes he has been like this but now it seems to be getting a bit worse....its to the point that anything i want to do without him is a big deal...even if he already has plans with his friends., I wasnt meaning to ask if i was flirting but is it flirting cause they do what they do....and he calls it flirting. I did talk to one guy that use to be with them ( he isnt anymore) nothing big just hi or lil chit chat but nothing major or for my man to get all worked up over. I know that that guy was flirting with me cause he smiled and stared at me all the time and im thinking that what got these guys to continue to be that way even though he isnt with them anymore.

i dont mean in no way to sound like im the cats meaow the problem is i say its not flirting at all and ofcourse my man thinks otherwise and im trying to get it accross to him not ever guy that walks by wants me....i should be flattered somewhat im sue that he feels that way but its getting out of hand.....like i said he flirts even tho he says no....as im sure i do sometimes and may not really realize it,,,,,i know when i set out to flirt and how sometimes its just me being what i think is just nice but can be taken that way i guess.

i have asked him to just tell me what he wants....meaning more hand holding kissing what? and i get no answer,,,,i think i just have to show more affection towards him on my own cause he wont open up to me about that

so any advice would be great thanks

How do you women find guys like this, and why do you stay with them? Once in awhile, men meet a woman like this, but it is more rare. Its even more rare that the guy asks her out again, or stays around.

If this is his usually demeanor around you and other people, he is SICK! MENTALLY ILL! He either has to get help, or you have to get away from him. Jealousy like this is an expression of SELF DOUBT by him, and no compliment to you. You tell us enough that makes me think this is not some passing insecurity. When he questions a woman why she is getting made up before going out, and " who are you trying to impress?", he is thinking ' HOW DO I CONTROL HER"?

Control freaks are about the most dangerous and unpredictable people to be around. They find and meet a woman who is attractive, and who is fooled into thinking that they want to love the woman, but in reality, the only person they love is #1, and the thought of her leaving them for another person, real or imagined can run them into a violent rage. They stalk women who leave them. They stalk women who stay with them. They become so obsessed with controlling women that they call her all the time, and interrogate her about who she has met, what they talked about, what was said, when are they going to meet again, where are they going to meet, etc. The bit in the bowling alley when the guys spotted you and made comments to themselves which he saw but did not hear, is an example of how this obsessive behavior begins.

This is not normal behavior. He is not normal. He is sick. He needs professional help, and his family, his girlfriend, and his work associates cannot help him. All you can do is try to save yourself by getting as far away from him as soon as possible. You may have to get a restraining order against him even if you do separate, to prevent him trying to contact you. Don't hesitate to do so. These guys walk a fine line between sanity and insanity, and are great con artists. I wish I had a dollar for every time a police officer was conned by one of these guys into thinking the woman complaining about him contacting her is nuts, not him. These guys are arrogant enough to use that line on their own lawyers, too. I have seen some of them conned, too.

This is a serious problem. Don't wait, and don't hesitate. If you insist, demand that he get to a psychiatrist immediately, or else. He will tell you there is nothing wrong with him, and refuse to go. He will even suggest that you must have a problem so you go see a psychiatrist. Take that as your walking papers, and leave. Tell him" You are right. I do have a problem. " Then leave.

I don't often tell sane people to see professionals, but this is one of those times when I don't hesitate to tell you or anyone else in this situation to talk to a psychiatrist- about him. See if you don't get the same advice I am telling you. After doing divorce work for 30 years, I have helped more than one woman through the mess of getting away from these kinds of guys. I have also seen women who refused to act Murdered by their SOs.

Please take my advice seriously. You are in very grave danger if you stay with this guy. He will only get worse.

Howard

Howard i really think you hit the nail on the head....i started think about other things in the past and he has been one way alone with me to make me upset etc....then act like he did nothing and doesnt know why i was acting that way when he was in front of people or when i would bring it up to other people....he does think of only himself. He didnt at the start but more and more i see it happening....i guess that like you said they way they get you and control you....I will get away and do what i have to to keep him away.....THANK YOU ALOT

My turn!!

Men do have insecurities. Your SO says the same thing mine does: Why am I dressed up and who am I trying to impress? I tell him over and over again: I dress up to look hot FOR YOU and if the other men see it, then great... they'll see I'm with YOU and they'll think what a lucky SOB you are to have this woman on your arm cause I"m not going anywhere!!

(men always complain when we're not ready on time...I think it says in the Male Handbook they have to whine even if we're just 1 minute late...LOL)

hey its nice to know im not alone on this.....he drives me crazy with the why are you doing this or that i tell him its for him and for me. all i get is that i dont need makeup etc.....i tell him to stop but it just keeps going on and on and on,,,,,but like Howard said it seems to be more then just inssecure so im really thinking of getting away from him

[sexykitty]

Ok, to answer your question, NO, it is not flirting. To "flirt" you have to be a willing participant, engaging the other guys by doing something to at least call attention to yourself besides "being you." Like, talking suggestively, sucking on your straw seductively, batting your eyelashes at all of them and licking your lips - that is flirting - and probably sexual advancing. What you did, coming into the bowling alley, is NOT.

Second, Howard is a bit of an extremist. I think you should be concerned about your guy's insecurities and set him straight a bit. Hey, if he wants you to look like a slob when you leave the house, see how he likes that! I had a guy who always said I looked "too good" when I went out, so the next time he came to pick me up I had no make-up, my hair was in a ponytail (and not a cutsie one) I had on sweats and a stained t-shirt. He was like WTF???? I said, hey, you said I looked too good. I made him take me to the party and his friends all pointed and stared, but the women - they knew what I was doing! He never, ever did that to me again. I wore what I wore when I wanted to wear it - and he never said a WORD AGAIN!

Back to Howard, I am not sure if he is "sick" as much as terribly insecure! He might have had a girl cheat on him in the past, perhaps with a friend, that might be the deal. Unfortunately, if you tell him you are with him and he doesn't believe it, there is nothing else you can do.

So, before you start running for the hills, try talking to him - or, taking a less sever tactic!

Mikayla

Thanks for the advice....you are right he did have a girl cheat on him he was engaged to her when he was in the navy and she was out with another guy and his parents seen her so she introduced her new bf to them...i alway tell him dont make me pay for her mistakes....my love life hasnt been without hurt and fail....and i may have been a bit jealous in the begining but im pass that for the most part. Im sure you would agree we all are jealous at some point. If a girl was really coming on to him i wouldnt just be sitting there but im not as bad as i use to be with the i seen you looking at her stuff etc. Howard has point out a few good points and as i sat and thought he has hit the nail on the head for the most part. Im going to give him a chance and talk to him more but if in a few months nothing changes then i have to head for the hills

THANKS AGAIN........i was really glad to get your point of view i know that you said you have dated alot so im sure you ran into a guy like this at sometime in your life....(which you have said in this post) its like i was this way when you met me and you attracted to me ,,,,so why try to change me? right....what if your husband turned out like this,,,,,( from what i know you wouldnt put up with it) but what if.....or has he ever asked you not to get all done up before you go out,??

im sure most men would love to have guys looking at the girl they are with knowing that he has what they cant but i got a dilly.....thats for sure

[newvixen]

I am willing to bet that there are many other people who read this site who have been through experiences with sick people like this guy. Maybe they will write in and make you a believer.

Howard

They say you can't learn from other people's mistakes and though I believe that to be true I do want to say that whatever decision you make, proceed with caution. Please!! My first serious boyfriend was 6 years older than me. I thought he was the greatest thing God ever put on the planet. In the beginning I didn't catch al of the clues or signs that something wasn't right. When he would get upset because some other man said something to me I would just think it was because he cared so much about me. Being on the inside it was difficult to see the changes that were taking place. Over a period of time I stopped going out with most of my friends because he would get jealous or upset if I didn't ask permission first. There were times when we'd talk and he wouldn't want to do anything so I'd go to a movie with a girlfriend and then he'd freak out on me. Finally it was easier to just not go.

It didn't happen over night. It escalated over a period of time. First was the jealousy and then came the anger. I was young and "stupid", I thought that if i could just prove to him I loved only him everything would be ok. After a year and a half of dating exclusively, one evening I went out with my best friend, who was also his cousin. We went to get an ice cream cone. while at the ice cream shop we ran into her brother. My friend and I have been best friends since we were 5 years old. Her family is like my family. When we all went back to her house, boyfirend was there. He had been drinking and when he saw us he hit the roof. That was the first time he hit me.

I wish I could say I was smart enough to walk away and it was the last time, but I wasn't. I stuck around and went through alot more episodes of his jealousy and rage. I stayed with him for 15 years. I probably would have stayed even longer but one night he found me while I was at the bowling alley, bowling with my church league. He lost his temper in the bowling alley. By the time the police arrived I was unconcious because he was choking me. I spent 2 days in the hospital and with the help of some counselors there and family I walked away and never looked back.

Not all men are like this. The man I'm with now is wonderful and would never lay a hand on me. However I do caution any woman who is dealing with a jealous man to be careful and to be sure you have a good support system. There are alot of great organizations out there to help women. Not ever jealous man ends up being abusive but the issue has to be dealt with and resolved right away. In my opinion only.

[Mikayla1]

NewVixen, thanks for sharing your story, and I am so very sorry for what happened to you.

This is an excellent example of what Howard was talking about in reference to the "progression" of steps from jealousy to rage to murder. I still do not believe that every guy will become this guy. Only the person in the relationship will be able to judge if what that person is doing or saying is bordering on "obessive" or "possessive" is probably the better word.

If Sexykitty's man is anything like this guy - then of course, get away, get out, run, run, run.....however, from that first, initial post....I did not gather ANY of those signs accept he didn't like any of his friends gawking at his girl - which is a common thing for many men who are INSECURE. Now, after her subsequent post giving MORE information, I can see how this guy could possibly have the propensity to become a problem.

We CAN learn from other people's mistakes - that is what life is about. Sometimes others go through a tradegy so we don't have to - and I am very, very sorry that you had to.

Mikayla

[Mikayla1]

NewVixen, thanks for sharing your story, and I am so very sorry for what happened to you.

This is an excellent example of what Howard was talking about in reference to the "progression" of steps from jealousy to rage to murder. I still do not believe that every guy will become this guy. Only the person in the relationship will be able to judge if what that person is doing or saying is bordering on "obessive" or "possessive" is probably the better word.

If Sexykitty's man is anything like this guy - then of course, get away, get out, run, run, run.....however, from that first, initial post....I did not gather ANY of those signs accept he didn't like any of his friends gawking at his girl - which is a common thing for many men who are INSECURE. Now, after her subsequent post giving MORE information, I can see how this guy could possibly have the propensity to become a problem.

We CAN learn from other people's mistakes - that is what life is about. Sometimes others go through a tradegy so we don't have to - and I am very, very sorry that you had to.

Mikayla

[newvixen]

NewVixen, thanks for sharing your story, and I am so very sorry for what happened to you.

This is an excellent example of what Howard was talking about in reference to the "progression" of steps from jealousy to rage to murder. I still do not believe that every guy will become this guy. Only the person in the relationship will be able to judge if what that person is doing or saying is bordering on "obessive" or "possessive" is probably the better word.

If Sexykitty's man is anything like this guy - then of course, get away, get out, run, run, run.....however, from that first, initial post....I did not gather ANY of those signs accept he didn't like any of his friends gawking at his girl - which is a common thing for many men who are INSECURE. Now, after her subsequent post giving MORE information, I can see how this guy could possibly have the propensity to become a problem.

We CAN learn from other people's mistakes - that is what life is about. Sometimes others go through a tradegy so we don't have to - and I am very, very sorry that you had to.

Mikayla

Thank you Mikayla. Although I would never want to go thru this situation again, it was a learning experience and definitely helped me to appreciate the good things in my life. It also helped make me the person I am toady. Someone who is much stronger and aware and would not fall into it again.

Not every man ends up like this. One of my assistants at work found herself in a similar situation. She addressed the issue with her hubby. She told him what behaviour she would accept and what she wouldn't. When he relapsed she gave him a choice. Counseling or divorce. In September she will celebrate her 12 year Anniversary. He got counseling and eventually they went to counseling together. I think most often it does progress over time but sometimes it's hard to recognize the signs.

I do volunteer work at the center that helped me when I needed it and alot of times all I do is share my experiences and listen to women that have had similar experiences. Most often I find that it's easier for them to talk to me than it is some of the others because I share my own personal experiences with them. Like them I felt stupid for being involved with someone like that but I also tend to find that like me the behaviour progressed over time and they did not recoginze it for what it was. Also like me more often than not, there was some emotional abuse and the women felt like it was their fault.

After hearing some of their experiences I can only imagine the things Howard must hear and I can understand his reaction. For anyone in this situation all I can advise is to deal with it quickly and get help. There are so many great organizations out there that willingly and freely provide assistance to women in this type of situation.

[Tyger]

OK, I've read the posts, and WOW!!

All I can say, is that I've dealt with my fair share of jealous BFs, and 2 husbands. The first husband I found was jealous cuz he was cheating himself. My current (2nd) husband, will sometimes say "who are you getting all dolled up for?" when I am getting ready for work. I've always tried to look my best when going to work, whether it be the waitressing job at a little diner, or at a Fine Jewelry counter. So I tell him I do this for work. He knows this. Sometimes his comments irritate the heck outta me , but I am too stubborn to let it bother me.

I know he's been cheated on, and can understand it to a degree, but I've never given him a reason to be this way. Nor am I afraid that he will go all violent on me. Now, he's threatened that if I ever cheated, that I'd better run. But I've also come back to him that if he ever cheated, I would cut off his penis as well, so it's serious about the cheating, but not the actions. Make sense?

As far as Kitty goes, I'm not sure what to tell you here. If it keeps getting worse, maybe not only reconsider your relationship, but wonder if he is cheating on you. Cheaters get guilty consciouses, and then think "well, if I'M doing this, why can't SHE be cheating too?", and turns the guilt around on YOU.

I'm not saying he is or isn't, but it's been my experience that this is what is normally happening.

Now, with regards to Howard, who normally makes lots of sense. I respect his past experiences, understand them, and sympathize. BUT, not all cheaters are going to get violent. It depends on the person, and their anger threshold. If the guy is getting demanding, controlling (i.e. telling you what you can and can't wear, who you will and will not hang with), then this IS a major cause for concern. If he gets violent about what he thinks of your actions or what you're wearing (like hitting walls, throwing things, ripping up your clothing) that is also a MAJOR cause for concern. These are clues I've picked up on at least.

Your explained behavior of just walking by, watching some guys bowl, IMO, is NOT flirting. Unless, like mentioned, there was certian body language done by you. You can't help comments made to you or about you from the opposite sex, and he should feel flattered that someone else finds you attractive, so long as they were not crude or disrespectful about it to you.

[hrnychick]

OK, I've read the posts, and WOW!!

All I can say, is that I've dealt with my fair share of jealous BFs, and 2 husbands. The first husband I found was jealous cuz he was cheating himself. My current (2nd) husband, will sometimes say "who are you getting all dolled up for?" when I am getting ready for work. I've always tried to look my best when going to work, whether it be the waitressing job at a little diner, or at a Fine Jewelry counter. So I tell him I do this for work. He knows this. Sometimes his comments irritate the heck outta me , but I am too stubborn to let it bother me.

I know he's been cheated on, and can understand it to a degree, but I've never given him a reason to be this way. Nor am I afraid that he will go all violent on me. Now, he's threatened that if I ever cheated, that I'd better run. But I've also come back to him that if he ever cheated, I would cut off his penis as well, so it's serious about the cheating, but not the actions. Make sense?

As far as Kitty goes, I'm not sure what to tell you here. If it keeps getting worse, maybe not only reconsider your relationship, but wonder if he is cheating on you. Cheaters get guilty consciouses, and then think "well, if I'M doing this, why can't SHE be cheating too?", and turns the guilt around on YOU.

I'm not saying he is or isn't, but it's been my experience that this is what is normally happening.

Now, with regards to Howard, who normally makes lots of sense. I respect his past experiences, understand them, and sympathize. BUT, not all cheaters are going to get violent. It depends on the person, and their anger threshold. If the guy is getting demanding, controlling (i.e. telling you what you can and can't wear, who you will and will not hang with), then this IS a major cause for concern. If he gets violent about what he thinks of your actions or what you're wearing (like hitting walls, throwing things, ripping up your clothing) that is also a MAJOR cause for concern. These are clues I've picked up on at least.

Your explained behavior of just walking by, watching some guys bowl, IMO, is NOT flirting. Unless, like mentioned, there was certian body language done by you. You can't help comments made to you or about you from the opposite sex, and he should feel flattered that someone else finds you attractive, so long as they were not crude or disrespectful about it to you.

I agree with the above post.........I know a girl that is going through this almost same exact situation......its a long story but points of the above post and other ring true to whats going on with her.....her guy has flirted to the point that it lead to phone calls with the girl he flirted with.....he said he never slept with her or did anything sexual and she believes him and the phone calls and flirting all came to an end and is from what she has told me over.....but now he is on her like Kitty's man is to her.....why you wearing that? who are you trying to impress? and the one she gets told ALL THE TIME is what took you so long shopping? then he would say to her oh i guess you didnt want to leave him to soon .

Her answer to all of his remarks is just a passive way of telling him to stop or its not true. She avoids what could lead to a big fight,,,,,,I really dont know how she can stand it but its her choice to stay with him and be treated like that anyway as you can see he is being this way towards her AFTER what he has done by the phone calls with the other women.....like the aboue post said its all cause of the guilt.....now like i said she said he isnt cheating and as far as she knows hasnt had any sexual cheating......I say yes he has cheated emiotionally......but my point is that he hurt her and crossed or came close to crossing the line in thier relationship and now he fears her doing the same and it taking its toll on him and is leading him to act the way he is.......by the way she has never cheated on him and has given him no reason to think otherwise so its his own guilt like i said that makes him act the way he does.

I have told her to come to this site and read the posts on this topic (and others) hoping that she will see the llght and move on finding someone who will treat her like she should be treated.....not making everything she does for herself an issue. I dont know why someone would want to put up with comments and rude remarks everyday of his or her life.....life is to short to live like that.....

[sexykitty]

Hello its been awhile since i have posted. Thanks for all the views on how i should handle the topic i started about my man and is it flirting. An update for anyone who is wanting to know.....i broke it off with him.....just couldnt take the remarks anymore.....as i have read in some of the posts here i know i wasnt alone in having a man like this and i hope the others in the same situation will really think about moving on and finding a person who treats them like they should be treated.

I dont think he would have become hurtful in anyother way then his words which was enough for me.....i know it couldve been a lot worse......he never called me names or hit me or anything like that but the constant "who are you dressing up for" and " where were you so long who were you with" was more than i could take. I didnt give up easy i gave it a try and second and a third but no change so i said goodbye.....it ended rather well......better then i thought.

[curvacious_lust]

Way to be a Woman! Good for you!! Now, upward and onward to much better men!! Keep us updated!!

[Tyger]

Glad to see an update!! WTG on the decent break up. Hopefully, this man will learn from his mistake, and treat the next lady LIKE A lady!

[tyciol]

They're flirting 'at' you. No one can control that short of a restraining order, and nothing has occured to give precidence for that.

'With' requires you to respond flirtatiously, and you didn't mention doing anything at all. Tell your husband that yeah, they're probably attracted to you, but you're attracted to him, or whatever. Or maybe play it in reverse and tell him women are looking at him, and that you don't appreciate his infidelity for remaining opaque

[VALERIE]

On this we will disagree, and I hope you don't have cause to regret your advice. What did I see that made me think this is more than some immature guy acting jealous? His behavior at the Bowling alley and his reaction to other men looking at her and whispering about her was the first big clue. This is more than jealousy- this is paranoia! Then his behavior at home about her dressing up shows how irrational he is being . On one hand, he thinks his "friends " are flirting with her( because she has said or done something to egg them on), and then he doesn't want her to dress up for him for fear others will notice her? He can't take pride in being with a good looking , well dressed woman, but instead is upset whether she does something inappropriate or not. She did not " Flirt " with the men at the bowling alley. That is all in his head. She is not flirting with unknown people when she decided to dress up to go out with him. She dresses up for her own self image( all women do, or should), and for him. If other men and women stare because she is so attractive, that is a compliment to her, and to him! But, he can't see it that way. To him, he only fears losing her to someone else. To compensate for his feelings of inferiority, he tries to gain control, by questioning her loyalty and love for him. He is trying to make her jump every time she does something so he doesn't have to worry about losing her. Inside, he hates her, because he blames her for the bad feelings he has about losing her, and his lack of self worth. That is what makes him so damn dangerous.

That is what I got out of it. I have interviewed literally hundreds of people in these kinds of relationships. I did the same thing you are doing with the first few. Then I met women who had done as you now advise, and suffered even more for trying to " talk " to him about his insecurities. Do you really expect this guy to admit to her how deeply insecure he feels about their relationship? I think he would rather be torn apart my four horses than to admit it to HER, of all people. That is why he needs professional help. If a professional gets to him early there is a good chance of working with him and dealing with this issue so he does not degenerate into violent outbursts against her, which is how most men deal with emotional frustrations. It begins with shouting and screaming, and then to thowing things, and then to breaking things, and then to hitting her. IF she still stays, believing his lies about how much he really loves her, and how truly sorry he is for hitting her, and how he promises he will never hit her again, etc., his contempt for her will know no bounds. His hatred for her will increase, and the violence will increase in direct proportion. I also used to think that women, and some men in similar situations had time to try to talk to their SOs about their jealously, because I first thought there was this natural progression from jealousy through all the stages I have described above, until I had a client who was killed by her SO when he skipped all those other stages. That is when I became an " Alarmist" as you describe me.

I make no apologies for being an alarmist on this subject.

Howard

I DISAGREE, LIKE MIKAYLA I TOO HAVE BEEN THAT TYPE OF RELATIONSHIP. YES SHE SHOULD BE CAREFUL. A WOMAN SHOULD NEVER LET A MAN MAKE HER FEEL GUILTY, FOR NOTHING EATHER. THERE IS A BIG DIFFERENCE BETWEEN AN OBSSEVIVE MAN & JUST A LITTLE JEALOUSY. AS LONG AS HE DOES'NT HURT HER PHYSICALLY OR MENTALLY, I REALLY DON'T SEE OBSSESIVE, & AS LONG HE'S NOT BRAIN WASHING UNWANTED CHANGES IN HER LIFE. ALL THATS LEFT IS TO FOLLOW YOUR INSTINCS & KEEP CONFIDING IN FRIENDS JUST IN CASES.

[DaniLovell]

I am glad for you that you broke the relationship off. I have been in a similar situation before, and have helped friends in the same. One thing that helped me was an analogy my Gran gave me. She didn't know all the details, just that there was trouble in paradise. So she told me about a frog. Bear with me here. " If you take a frog and try to toss him in a pot of boiling water, he will jump right out. Makes sense, nobody want to get boiled alive. Now, on the other hand, if you put a frog in a pot of tap water on a stove, he will just keep swimmin to his hearts content. Raise the heat a little and he will still stay there, up to the point of boiling. " She didn't go any further, but she didn't have to. I got the point. I guess you could say my pot was boiling but i didn't even realise it b/c i was swimming in it. That woman was full of wisdom, man i miss her.